Josh's Syclone build thread

Goodgollyjosh

Active member
As you can see, I keep records of everything lol. Also, in case you didn't know...there's a limit of 10,000 words per post. Yeah, I discovered that real fast. I can bend your ear for hours if you let me.
 

Goodgollyjosh

Active member
The trans quit on me again. Upon taking it apart I noticed that the rod fell off the end of the Sports Machines' reproduction TV cable. Normally, the rod is held in place by the cable housing and requires disconnecting it at the throttle body to pull the cable out far enough to detach the rod (most GM vehicles). However, it appears that the housing on the reproduction cable is too large among all the other issues that I have had with the cable. As mentioned, I will be looking at the option of a repair kit that allows me to cut the bottom portion of the reproduction housing off and install a different housing end on it. The other option is a B&M universal TV cable. I will play around with both and talk it over with my trans builder. He is a co-worker of mine and we have been working diligently to get this pesky 700r4 to hold together a little better.

Forum member Proptop suggested I talk with Chris at CK performance transmissions in NY and he advised me to pay close attention to the clutch housing for 3rd and 4th gear and to check for hairline cracks. He also suggested I use an oil diverter in my trans oil pump to send extra fluid to the non lock up converter for better cooling. I have also purchase a larger trans cooler and will be swapping out the 4 pass unit the truck came with. I know that the factory trans is junk when it comes to trying to go fast in these trucks...but I'm only aiming for low 12's at this point. My only other option is a turbo 350 because I can't afford a 4L80 right now and I refuse to chop up the truck to install a T56. Hopefully, we will get this trans built up nice and get a decent TV cable in her. This is the 3rd rebuild since my ownership and 4th rebuild in the truck's life...with only 37k miles, that's nuts when you put it like that.

Also, I have been working with forum member WyoSyclone who helped me to get my Tuner Pro working with his code 59 software. We successfully datalogged the truck the other day so that was good news because it has been months since I have had the datalogging portion of tuner pro operational. I was contacted by Turbo Tweak who suggested I deal with a few things before buying his stuff. He said I needed to get the IAC working correctly before buying his chip because he didn't think his tune would be able to fix that issue. He said he has had problems with aftermarket throttle bodies not allowing the IAC to do it's job properly.

As mentioned, I have replaced the IAC motor, checked/replaced any questionable vacuum lines, and sprayed carb cleaner around the intake manifold to see if I had any leaks, nothing turned up. I think next I will use a smoke machine to check for leaks and if that yields nothing then I may look at trying to find an original throttle body. Just to reiterate the issues with this system...basically, it stalls when I use the IAC. So, I disconnected it and turned up the idle a little. Once the truck is warm it no longer stalls. However, I know that this is not the correct way to deal with this so I will try and find the issue. Turbo Tweak also mentioned that I can't tune his system with Tuner Pro, he said I can data log but can't adjust the bin files. He didn't suggest what software I needed so I'm not sure what to do about that. He is one of those guys that gives one sentence answers to things, you kind of have to dig to get a decent response out of him, but I'm sure he's tired of dealing with the uninitiated like me when it comes to OBD 1 tuning.

WyoSyclone also suggested I get my wideband running through the ECM so that I can data log it so I will be working on that as well. Once the trans is back in I am going to install the larger injectors again and see if I can self tune this thing a little bit. More updates to come...

700r4, resized.png
 
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proptop

Donating Member
Josh,
I know who I am calling to pull my Tranny next time as you are an Expert at it by now.
Bob
 

Goodgollyjosh

Active member
Well, the trans has been taking a bit longer than usual but my buddy is really putting in a lot of time to make sure we get it built up right this time. Unfortunately, he is having to fix someone else's work. If it was just a stock untouched trans this whole process would have been a lot faster and also probably only would have to be built up once. But, it appears the trans shop in Phoenix that built this thing for the previous owner did some stuff that isn't kosher. I am not a trans expert but my buddy has been showing me some things along the way and will update on this soon. In the meantime, we did get Sports Machines kickdown cable repaired. As previously mentioned, we cut the end off that goes in the trans, and adapted a piece to it that allows 360 rotation so that you can make sure it is not in a bind when stabbing it into the trans and then you can lock it down with the nut in the photo. I have been trying to tell Sports Machines that the end is crimped on 180 degrees off but I don't think they seem interested in investigating this more. It is a reproduction unit since GM doesn't make the cable any longer. At any rate, we will give this a go and hope the end doesn't warp like it did in the previous photo I attached (actually warped twice, this is my second cable).

I also took the time to smoke the intake manifold and fix a leak I found at the IAC valve. I have a base level tune uploaded courtesy of WyoSyclone with the 50 lb/hr injectors installed. We will give that a shot and try and tune it from there. He had also suggested I get the wideband running through the factory ECM so that we can datalog it so I took care of that. Oh, and I upgraded the trans cooler too since the one it came with was only a 4 pass unit. Hopefully, she will be running good come fall and winter here in Texas so that I can beat on it when it is nice and cool outside. Looking forward to dyno day and track day.

kick down cable repair, resized.pngsmoke machine, resized.pngsyclone ecm 2, resized.png
trans cooler, resized.png
 
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ontario026

New member
Love the progress report, great looking Syclone! I am awaiting arrival of my new to me Typhoon, and am looking forward to working through it's issues, and will try and document it's progress as I go as well....
 

Goodgollyjosh

Active member
I finally got the trans installed. We did some things different this time. We have added 4 more clutches to the 3rd and 4th gear pack, we installed an oil diverter to flow more oil to the non-lock up converter, we removed an o-ring on the input shaft which is also suppose to allow more converter flow, and most importantly we discovered that the shop who built this trans for the last owner did something that wasn't kosher. We were doing some diagnostic work on the trans since it continues to fail the 3rd and 4th gear clutch pack and when applying pressure to the clutches when they were inside their housing we found that is was bleeding off the pressure way too fast. Upon further inspection we noticed that there are suppose to be a check ball with spring and a bleed valve on the drum but instead someone had modified it and removed the check ball and spring and installed a secondary bleed valve. We removed the secondary bleed valve and installed the correct check ball and spring and re-applied pressure, and it held beautifully and bled off slowly like it was suppose to.

Another mod they had performed was they installed the extreme duty pressure regulator system from CK performance in NY. We kept this system in place. The valve body does not have a shift kit as another Sy expert of mine said the syty's never respond well to shift kits when running the stock 700r4. He also recommended we run non-synthetic trans fluid and add one bottle of lube guard since he said there was a TSB about this from years ago. He did also mention that the valve body has a factory modification for the 1-2 shift, we left this alone. The last thing we did was to bend the kick down cable rod a little to keep it from coming off accidentally. I have no idea how that happened this last time unless it was the Sports Machines kick down cable warping that allowed this. We have the cable adjusted to be piano wire tight at WOT. At any rate, I have some tuning to do with WYOSyclone but otherwise would love to be driving this thing again soon. Also, just a side note, I am not a trans expert, my buddy is great with stock transmissions but has been on a learning curve also with this previously modified trans. I realize I could have just taken it somewhere to have it professionally built but I am enjoying learning about it and will hopefully feel satisfied when it finally stays together. Please forgive any improper technical transmission nomenclature.

extreme duty oil pressure regulator system resized.jpgkick down cable rod, resized.pngtorque converter o-ring, resized.pngmissing check ball, resized.pngoil diverter, resized.png
 

Mikeysy15

Donating Member
Hang in there buddy. I just went through your a whole post. I know all of us have gone through this one way or another . Also, low 12’s is easy on these trucks . Once you swap turbo and Injectors you’ll see how easy it is to run 11’s. Good luck . After your done , your happiness will be when you get that timeslip and it’s faster then what you expected . You’ll know that all the hard work was worth it .
 

Goodgollyjosh

Active member
I got the driveshaft safety loops in and started her up for the first time in a few months. The initial tune is running pretty well. I am going to data log the start and idle and send them to WyoSyclone for his opinion. He is going to give me some pointers with code 59 so that I can do this stuff myself. I have tuning experience but not with OBD1, tuner pro, bin 58, or code 59. So, this will be a learning curve for me.

front driveshaft loop, resized.pngrear driveshaft loop, resized.png
 

Goodgollyjosh

Active member
Thanks Bob, she is coming along. Hopefully be at the dyno and track soon. Then we'll see what breaks next lol. Maybe that stage 1 prop shaft. I hope your "research project" is going nicely too.
 

proptop

Donating Member
Josh,
Haven't worked on it. Sold my last Big Inch small block Nitrous motor and part of the deal was putting it in for the fellow. Also bought a Stage two Motor for my Buick (been looking for this thing for years) so I have been changing a few items that I didn't like (ie rocker arms) so I called T&D and had them build me some. Just need to do a little work on the pushrod holes for clearance, then finish the port work to get the Intake to fit then we should be good to go. Then maybe I can get back to Lunch Money. Thanks for asking.
Bob
 

Goodgollyjosh

Active member
So, I am sad to report that the trans did not last. I have pulled it out for the last time. I am frustrated with it but I am going to keep it in case I ever revert the truck back to stock. I cruised the racing junk ads and found a fresh turbo king TH350 with trans brake, reverse pattern manual valve body, and lots of other goodies inside as well as a 3200 stall converter that is new. I made the 7 hour round trip to Tomball this morning to pick it up. I have purchased the spacer that makes the TH350 the same length as a 700r4 so my driveline dimensions will stay the same once the 700r4 tail shaft housing is bolted on the end of it.

I also got a ratchet shifter and will be installing that soon. I have a technical question for you guys. What all do I need to do when tricking the truck to run when the factory shifter is not installed? I assume I will have to jump the neutral safety switch? Do I need to jump any pins on the lock up harness for the trans? Also, feel free to point me in the direction of any old threads that might be helpful. I'll post pics of the new set up soon.
 

proptop

Donating Member
Josh,
Not much help here on the wiring. One positive note is the TH350 will keep the motor in the power band better on the gear changes and should also be helpful with not KNOCKING the tires off of the truck when it leaves. Well that was my approach when I changed the gear set in the 700 R4.
Bob
 

Goodgollyjosh

Active member
That is great news Bob! I would have loved to do a 4L80 swap since it seems like all the rage around here but it is simply out of my budget at the moment.
 

DaveP's Ghost

Well-known member
The purple and yellow wires at the shifter are the P/N safety switch. Not sure how to incorporate a P/N switch on a ratehet shifter, but there should be one.
The blu and lt green wires are the back up lights.
The orn/blk (signal) and blk/wht (ground) wire on the shifter switch is a signal to the ECM that the trans is in Park or Neutral. This information is used for idle control, EGR, Code 24 diagnostic, and in a Typhoon, the tailgate release button.

The EGR will probably be deleted in the tune.

If you short the orn/blk to ground (ECM thinks it is always in P or N) there may be stalling problems when coming to a stop. Here's why: When in P or N, the ECM attempts to control idle speed to the programmed speed. When driving, the ECM will still try to control RPM to idle speed, so the IAC will be commanded to zero-counts. On a stop, the ECM may not be able to command the IAC to open quickly enough to prevent the stall.

I would ask Rob (Wyosyclone) what he thinks. I would probably leave the orn/blk un-grounded to prevent the stalling, write-out the Code 32, Code 24 Diagnostics, and defeat the EGR in the .bin.

You don't have to do anything with the lock-up or transmission wiring. There are no DTCs associated with the lock-up.
 
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Goodgollyjosh

Active member
Thanks Dave! All good info. I did contact Rob prior to writing that question and he didn't have much info on that stuff and suggested I post it in the FB Syclone page but I don't have social media so I figured here would be as good a place as any. I will play around with it a bit and make the recommendations to Rob that you suggested for the tune. I am currently trying to get the IAC up and running again, I have operated for a long time without it and been quite happy but I know that isn't the right way to do it. I ran for a short time with Rob's bin for 50 pound injectors before the trans quit again, the IAC was hooked up and it never stalled so we may be on to something. Thanks again for the help.
 

Goodgollyjosh

Active member
I got the TH350 mocked up today with the spacer and Syclone tail shaft housing. I took my measurements and I cut 1.5" off the tail shaft so that it doesn't bottom out in the transfer case. I also cut the inner webbing out of the shifter console support to make room for the ratchet shifter. I am trying to make it sit down lower so that I can retain my center console and make everything look nice. I also started fab'ing up some -6 stainless braided lines for my trans cooler. I'm in the process of routing them through the engine bay and taking one final measurement before cutting and crimping on the other end of the lines....measure twice, cut once. I took my Hayden trans cooler that had barbed ends for hoses to attach and I smoothed the ends off nicely and attached ferals and swedge lock fittings so I could attach my -6 lines. Lastly, I contacted WyoSyclone and mentioned to him the tune recommendations that Dave suggested and he made the necessary changes and send me the modified Bin. Things are progressing nicely....almost too nicely...I'm waiting for the next big hiccup to show it's ugly head.

trans adapter, resized.pngtrimmed console support, resized.pngtrans lines, resized.pnghayden cooler, resized.png
 
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