Customrestore selling all his stuff?

Norm

Donating Member
Re: Customrestore selling all his stuff?

I was talking to a fellow car guy about this auction and he said what do you think 30 or so of those vehicles coming up for sale at one time will do to their market value. Could go either way, help them or hurt them. But was a interesting point.
 

Spnknu

Member
Re: Customrestore selling all his stuff?

Vehicles sold at auction are normally sold at 70% market value. There has to be room to make money for the buyer if they only intended to re-sale the vehicle. Granted many of the vehicles are collector vehicle and whatever the buyer is willing to pay will set market value, but many of these vehicles will increase in value over time with the rarity and significant value of the vehicle. So that formula doesn't apply.

What I'm getting at is that "market value" = supply and demand. Low supply with high demand = a large market value. A high influx of maintained syclones & typhoons will drive the prices lower in theory, but people will still pay top dollar for a well maintained syty. Fair market value for a syty seems to be around 8-12k in decent condition seems to be normal.

The one exception to this rule is Harmon by buying up broken and beat sytys that further drive the prices up due to the poor influence of busted sytys in their market. He is the single reason that syty prices stay at a constant. Along with anyone who hoards sytys.

Many of the rare & collector vehicles that "sell" at this auction will not drive prices up nor will they bring them down. Because they won't see the market after the auction. I believe that many of the bidders/buyers at this auction will be collectors for the high-end/rare and dealers for the low-end less rare vehicles. Thus not really effecting the market on any of the vehicles.
 

warmpancakes

New member
Re: Customrestore selling all his stuff?

But A wholesale auction is not true market because not everybody can get in, now a auction like EBAY would be true "market" value because pretty much everybody has access,
 

ziembic

Donating Member
Re: Customrestore selling all his stuff?

LOL I like the term "greater fool" I think this fits me quite well.
 

phoonTy

Truckless. For now.
Re: Customrestore selling all his stuff?

Kelley book publishing. Buster Kelley was a neighbor of my friend's father (Louis) in SoCal. My friend's family have been Ford Dealers since the Model-T days. Louis and Buster were fishing and drinking buddies. Back in the day, the NADA Guide was being used to determine all used car values. Louis felt that NADA didn't accurately reflect the true value of SoCal cars, because the condition of our cars is so much better than the norm. Viola: The "Kelley [book publishing] Blue Book". Buster's boat was painted that familiar blue color, and named "Kelley's Girl".

At least that's the 'story' as I understand it.

So in terms of valuing a car, which is the better option? KBB or NADA?

Generally, for any value of things, I've been using Craigslist. That seems to be where the majority of "the market" is right now.
 

warmpancakes

New member
Re: Customrestore selling all his stuff?

Kelley book publishing. Buster Kelley was a neighbor of my friend's father (Louis) in SoCal. My friend's family have been Ford Dealers since the Model-T days. Louis and Buster were fishing and drinking buddies. Back in the day, the NADA Guide was being used to determine all used car values. Louis felt that NADA didn't accurately reflect the true value of SoCal cars, because the condition of our cars is so much better than the norm. Viola: The "Kelley [book publishing] Blue Book". Buster's boat was painted that familiar blue color, and named "Kelley's Girl".

At least that's the 'story' as I understand it.



Thanks:tup:
 

turboj91

New member
Re: Customrestore selling all his stuff?

Generally, for any value of things, I've been using Craigslist. That seems to be where the majority of "the market" is right now.[/QUOTE]


OK now let's define market. There are many catagories. Retail on a new car dealer level, Retail on a used car lot level (like a mom & pop used car lot not a new car dealers lot), wholesale at auction, wholesale to local small used car lot dealers ect... Prices and catagories are all over the place.

I don't put alot of significance to used car advertisements such as Craigslist as these are non inspected cars and you don't know what the actual selling price is compared to the asking price. And why is it for sale there? Someone need quick money for a bad habit, mortgage payment, get rid of it quick before the divorce, sell it to some poor bastard because it is at the end of its life ect, girlfriend that has her boyfriends car in her name because he has a bad driving record and she just caught him cheating so now she sells the car fast and cheap (we all have heard the stories of buying a car for one dollar)... Don't know its history unless it is inspected. Carfax only tells you the info it has in its database. If someone pays cash to fix heavy collision damage, you'll never know unless someone inspects the car. Prior collision history and quality of repairs have an effect on a car's value.

The good used cars are on a new car dealers used car lot. It's all down hill from there. A majority of the others are the cars that the new car dealers don't want. A wholesale person gets it from the dealer, finds out why the dealer did not want it, sells it at auction or to another wholesale person and the "food chain begins".

In order to determine a true market value for a specific vehicle, you first need to put it into a specific catagory for what the vehicle actually is.
 

dgoodhue

BuSTeD 4.3
Re: Customrestore selling all his stuff?

So in terms of valuing a car, which is the better option? KBB or NADA?

Generally, for any value of things, I've been using Craigslist. That seems to be where the majority of "the market" is right now.

IMO in my region, NADA seems much more accurate value for the added value of a car selling at a dealership. This for average cars with normal mileage. I find it falls short as a car get older.

In my area banks usually loan based on NADA. I find often dealers will use which ever book value is to their benefit when selling or trading a car.

I think with some research you can often come of with a fair market price is you follow it for a couple months. Craigslist pricing often can't be compare to book value bvecuase mostly it's private sales. Atleast the car dealers in my area that use craigslist, the cars usually have a history or aren't the cleanest example. They seem to cater to the cheapskates on craigslist.
 

dgoodhue

BuSTeD 4.3
Re: Customrestore selling all his stuff?

Generally, for any value of things, I've been using Craigslist. That seems to be where the majority of "the market" is right now.


OK now let's define market. There are many catagories. Retail on a new car dealer level, Retail on a used car lot level (like a mom & pop used car lot not a new car dealers lot), wholesale at auction, wholesale to local small used car lot dealers ect... Prices and catagories are all over the place.

I don't put alot of significance to used car advertisements such as Craigslist as these are non inspected cars and you don't know what the actual selling price is compared to the asking price. And why is it for sale there? Someone need quick money for a bad habit, mortgage payment, get rid of it quick before the divorce, sell it to some poor bastard because it is at the end of its life ect, girlfriend that has her boyfriends car in her name because he has a bad driving record and she just caught him cheating so now she sells the car fast and cheap (we all have heard the stories of buying a car for one dollar)... Don't know its history unless it is inspected. Carfax only tells you the info it has in its database. If someone pays cash to fix heavy collision damage, you'll never know unless someone inspects the car. Prior collision history and quality of repairs have an effect on a car's value.

The good used cars are on a new car dealers used car lot. It's all down hill from there. A majority of the others are the cars that the new car dealers don't want. A wholesale person gets it from the dealer, finds out why the dealer did not want it, sells it at auction or to another wholesale person and the "food chain begins".

In order to determine a true market value for a specific vehicle, you first need to put it into a specific catagory for what the vehicle actually is.

I like his explanation better about craigslist values :stupid:
 

GAShan

Donating Member
Re: Customrestore selling all his stuff?

The dealers I work for (high end/exotic) go exclusively by NADA Black Book. They keep the nice stuff and send the rest to auction, primarily Mannheim in Orlando. In their eyes no vehicle is excellent. You can buy a new car, drive it out the driveway and back in and it is never better than good. There is no such thing as an excellent car except brand new untitled ones with delivery miles only.
 

phoonTy

Truckless. For now.
Re: Customrestore selling all his stuff?

In their eyes no vehicle is excellent. You can buy a new car, drive it out the driveway and back in and it is never better than good. There is no such thing as an excellent car except brand new untitled ones with delivery miles only.

That's the way I've always felt. It's irritating to see dealers list their vehicles at "excellent" value, KBB or NADA. It just shows you that you will never get a "deal" from them.

I say I use Craigslist for value because that seems to be what people in the area are using for selling vehicles. If I have vehicles to sell, that's where I go. Autotrader has never done well for me and the hits out of the local paper have all but died. They may not be "accurate" but Craigslist prices are what people are paying in this area.

In any case, I guess it always goes back to the old standby: It's only worth what someone is willing to pay for it.
 

Customrestore

New member
Re: Customrestore selling all his stuff?

How many G8 Firehawks were made?
There were 34 G8 Firehawks made 25 GT Firehawks and 9 GXP Firehawks that were made at my request. We just did the Pontiac Power tour and had a blast. The tour went from Tallahassee, Fl to Carlisle, Pa. We showed a 1992 Pontiac Firehawk #21 of 25 (red), The 2009 Firehawk pilot car#001 and #2, #15 (red, white, blue) a The GXP Firehawks #4, #5 (black and a blue silver metallic). The cars were at the SLP Display and the Pontiac Enthuiastic Magazine Display. This was our first time at Carlisle and we'll be back with Syclones next year because there were none there. It is the GM Nationals. Glad to help.
 

Customrestore

New member
Re: Customrestore selling all his stuff?

That is an interesting point. Remember, this is a "reserve" auction on many of them. So the "price" has already been determined by the seller. If a car does not fetch it's reserve, than the highest bid offered could be taken as "market value" for that car by that bidder.

First the prices of the cars in the auction will be set by the demand of those people bidding on them. If few are interested, the bids will remain low. If a bidding frenzy breaks out, the bids will be higher.

As far as the hammer-prices affecting the value of cars NOT in that auction, it depends on what the selling prices are of the auction cars. If the hammer prices tend to be higher than recent sales prices, than the trend will be higher for all cars.

If the hammer prices are lower, than there are two possibilities regarding all cars: A: the value of all cars is now lower. B: The cars bought at auction will be re-sold on the market, increasing supply, and depressing prices.

If most of these cars sell, one thing is certain: The supply of cars in the market will be higher. (These 30 or so have been off the market for 4-5 years). bigger supply = lower prices, and more difficult to sell as there are more choices for the few buyers there are.

Edit: The Owners of the 7 red syclones that are NOT in the auction will be very interested in what the bids are on the three that ARE in the auction. There should be interest in the Marlboros. And the bid prices will set 'market value' for them for some time to come.

There will be very few reserves. FYI
 

Baythan

SY2TY2SY2TY
Re: Customrestore selling all his stuff?

There were 34 G8 Firehawks made 25 GT Firehawks and 9 GXP Firehawks that were made at my request. We just did the Pontiac Power tour and had a blast. The tour went from Tallahassee, Fl to Carlisle, Pa. We showed a 1992 Pontiac Firehawk #21 of 25 (red), The 2009 Firehawk pilot car#001 and #2, #15 (red, white, blue) a The GXP Firehawks #4, #5 (black and a blue silver metallic). The cars were at the SLP Display and the Pontiac Enthuiastic Magazine Display. This was our first time at Carlisle and we'll be back with Syclones next year because there were none there. It is the GM Nationals. Glad to help.

Thanks for the info, John. Interesting stuff.

If I'm not out in Reno next month, I'll take a ride out to Carlisle next year and say hello.
 
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