Help with piston selection *kinda long*

s10blaza

s10blaza

BOOSTED
I'm going to start from the beginning. The motor in the Ty finally took a shit, it has a constant hammering sound (way louder than a lifter tick) so its either a rod or a piston flopping around in the bore so a rebuild is in order. I have probably read 200+ threads these past few days talking about rebuilds.

Here is my biggest dilemma. The budget. I am literally in the middle of a divorce and my income got cut in half. I've been living paycheck to paycheck for several months now. The landscaping's gonna have to wait another year because I'm willing to put my entire income tax check towards the Ty, all $800 of it.

That's right, I have $800 to rebuild a SyTy shortblock. My biggest issue is piston selection. Since the TRW L2441 pistons have been discontinued ( Jegs, Summit, and my work can't get them, I even called Federal Mogul) the next option are SRPs, that's a big chunk of my budget gone :tdown:



I spoke to a very helpful fella at Summit and he found me the next best pistons, the TRW ZLW2603F30

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/TRW-LW2603F30/

He also said he'd be more than happy to substitute the flat tops in this kit

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/FEM-MHP121-300/

with the 2603s.

The compression ratio specs of these 2603s on a 60.5cc head is 9.28 which seems absurdly high.



My goal for the truck is to build it back to stock, but tons more reliable. I'm going forged as I HATE doing things twice and to give me some room for expansion later on down the road. I won't be doing 11s any time soon. The hypereutectics in there now lasted 160,00 mostly trouble free miles and I've known several people to run up to 25+psi on hypereutectic and cast pistons. Would they be ok on a relatively mild truck?
 
The Devils Own Chariot

The Devils Own Chariot

Active member
Re: Help with piston selection *kinda long*

I think any 350 small block piston will work. Just buy one with a 8.35:1 ratio. Are you getting it bored? Then get a .030 over piston.
 
bezerk

bezerk

New member
Re: Help with piston selection *kinda long*

why don't you score a later 2003 up 4.3 vortec motor low milage. have the lower intake welded and you can do it for under 500. you only need to retune it
 
warmpancakes

warmpancakes

New member
Re: Help with piston selection *kinda long*

you need to get the block checked before you buy pistons, they will cut the block to match the pistons, but you might not need a .030 piston you might need a .010 or a .020
 
Windedv6

Windedv6

Ty n 10s
Re: Help with piston selection *kinda long*

s10blaza said:
That is true, I'm just assuming it will need to get bored to .030 but everything forged I find online jumps straight to .030 from standard.

I found some Probe pistons that share the same number as the TRWs but the compression ratios are higher, if I read correctly our heads are about 62ccs?

http://www.probeindustries.com/Chevy_350_20_3cc_Dish_Top_FPS_Pistons_p/p2441f.htm
Click to expand...

That would be a good piston to use. It is the same material that is use in the SRP piston. The SRP piston CR would be at 8.5:1 as it has a slightly bigger dish, 22cc vs 20.3. The 8.7:1 CR of the Probe is fine and would not be noticable from an 8.5:1 CR.

I personally don't know the cost of this piston. Call Mark O'Neal, he owns Probe and is a nice person to do business with. Tell him someone from YellowBullet sent you. Phone: 866.249.9142

John
 
dgoodhue

dgoodhue

BuSTeD 4.3
Re: Help with piston selection *kinda long*

s10blaza said:
The landscaping's gonna have to wait another year because I'm willing to put my entire income tax check towards the Ty, all $800 of it.

That's right, I have $800 to rebuild a SyTy shortblock. My biggest issue is piston selection. Since the TRW L2441 pistons have been discontinued ( Jegs, Summit, and my work can't get them, I even called Federal Mogul) the next option are SRPs, that's a big chunk of my budget gone :tdown:



I spoke to a very helpful fella at Summit and he found me the next best pistons, the TRW ZLW2603F30

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/TRW-LW2603F30/

He also said he'd be more than happy to substitute the flat tops in this kit

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/FEM-MHP121-300/

with the 2603s.

The compression ratio specs of these 2603s on a 60.5cc head is 9.28 which seems absurdly high.
Click to expand...

9.28:1 isn't absurbly high CR. The issue is it will need a custom tune to make it work. 11psi will need about fueling of 14psi.

Maybe it's just me, but $800 isn't going to get it done in terms of a rebuild. Even if you get a free machining your going to spend more than few hundred on gaskets alone. With the part of a budget rebuild kit your budget going to be gone before you get to far in. Plus you have a 160K engine, unexpected parts/sensors are going to break when you pull it off with that many miles. You should be doing motor mounts as well with this rebuild.
 
0966Sy

0966Sy

Code what?
Re: Help with piston selection *kinda long*

Ralph at R&R motor and machine in san antonio is rebuilding my block for the Ty 0.30 over with new pistons. I dont remember what kind but they were, but only $280. He rebuilds a 4.3 shortblock with a good core out the door for $400. You pay the $280 extra for the pistons of course. 210-932-9385
 
s10blaza

s10blaza

BOOSTED
Re: Help with piston selection *kinda long*

Sy#2661 said:
9.28:1 isn't absurbly high CR. The issue is it will need a custom tune to make it work. 11psi will need about fueling of 14psi.

Maybe it's just me, but $800 isn't going to get it done in terms of a rebuild. Even if you get a free machining your going to spend more than few hundred on gaskets alone. With the part of a budget rebuild kit your budget going to be gone before you get to far in. Plus you have a 160K engine, unexpected parts/sensors are going to break when you pull it off with that many miles. You should be doing motor mounts as well with this rebuild.
Click to expand...

I guess I should mention that things like gaskets, rings and motor mounts will be no problem. I work at an auto parts store and this is my 6th S-series. I have almost an entire truck under warranty, every steering part, PS pumps, water pumps, sensors, you name it. I wasn't always broke lol. That and I get all parts at cost.

I just talked to Rodney at hitechracing and he has the Probe pistons for $300 and he says they're exactly the same thing as the TRWs.

So all I really need to actually buy are the pistons, MLS gaskets and rings (which I get dirt cheap) and machining and small odds and ends.

Last year I re-did the entire top end and replaced almost every sensor, had the injectors cleaned, timing set etc.. If anything I may just have to lap the valves

http://www.syty.net/forums/showthread.php?t=70797
 
Last edited:
bezerk

bezerk

New member
Re: Help with piston selection *kinda long*

to bad you didn't look at my advice. some people running verry strong on the later model blocks without being opened. you can do it for 500, safe yourself 300 from your goal (which i think is way to cheap to do a good rebuild with better pistons)
the next time you blow it you just buy another junkyard $300 block and swap intakes.
the newer style rods are much stronger than ours. you have vortec heads, better cam and 240 hp n/a engine you only need 6psi to have your 330 back and you can run them at 15psi with some tuning.
up to you, but throwing 400 pistons in a 800 build sounds like a bad idea. you need to balance, bore and still god your weak rods.
 
bezerk

bezerk

New member
Re: Help with piston selection *kinda long*

midnightbluS10 said:
The newer Vortecs only came with 190hp stock.
Click to expand...

wasn't in the build, must be emission related, i don't wan't this guy going head over heels with the build, to many build up trucks get sold because they are into deep. better have a deep pocket, or know you can get away with...... cheap builds to spare cash and keep boosting,

and the 190hp.. man if our engines didn't have the turbo they made 140hp??
 
s10blaza

s10blaza

BOOSTED
Re: Help with piston selection *kinda long*

bezerk said:
to bad you didn't look at my advice. some people running verry strong on the later model blocks without being opened. you can do it for 500, safe yourself 300 from your goal (which i think is way to cheap to do a good rebuild with better pistons)
the next time you blow it you just buy another junkyard $300 block and swap intakes.
the newer style rods are much stronger than ours. you have vortec heads, better cam and 240 hp n/a engine you only need 6psi to have your 330 back and you can run them at 15psi with some tuning.
up to you, but throwing 400 pistons in a 800 build sounds like a bad idea. you need to balance, bore and still god your weak rods.
Click to expand...

If it was that cheap and easy I would have gone that route, it was actually my first choice. First I have to score a decent motor, anything less than $400-500 here in MY town and its probably junk, the welding I can get done by RPM but I still have to take the heads off to get them drilled, which means new gaskets and other things "along the way". Then I have to worry about the tuning issue, which is something I would have to LEARN to do, plus buy all the equipment for it.

Trust me, I hate being frugal about this build, especially because its MY truck and like I said, I HATE doing things twice, but I have no other choice, I was left with a mortgage, utilities, car payment, insurance, student loans etc.. and the Ty has been sitting for months because of it. I refuse to do anything half-assed which is why I'm trying to at least build a decent block with the current budget. Nothing is stopping me from throwing a junkyard 4.3 motor in it, get it running and sell it off to some punk on craigslist. I waited for years to buy my Ty, I'm not going to give up on it that easily.
 
Windedv6

Windedv6

Ty n 10s
Re: Help with piston selection *kinda long*

s10blaza said:
I'm going to start from the beginning. The motor in the Ty finally took a shit, it has a constant hammering sound (way louder than a lifter tick) so its either a rod or a piston flopping around in the bore so a rebuild is in order. I have probably read 200+ threads these past few days talking about rebuilds.

Here is my biggest dilemma. The budget. I am literally in the middle of a divorce and my income got cut in half. I've been living paycheck to paycheck for several months now. The landscaping's gonna have to wait another year because I'm willing to put my entire income tax check towards the Ty, all $800 of it.

That's right, I have $800 to rebuild a SyTy shortblock. My biggest issue is piston selection. Since the TRW L2441 pistons have been discontinued ( Jegs, Summit, and my work can't get them, I even called Federal Mogul) the next option are SRPs, that's a big chunk of my budget gone :tdown:



I spoke to a very helpful fella at Summit and he found me the next best pistons, the TRW ZLW2603F30

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/TRW-LW2603F30/

He also said he'd be more than happy to substitute the flat tops in this kit

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/FEM-MHP121-300/

with the 2603s.

The compression ratio specs of these 2603s on a 60.5cc head is 9.28 which seems absurdly high.



My goal for the truck is to build it back to stock, but tons more reliable. I'm going forged as I HATE doing things twice and to give me some room for expansion later on down the road. I won't be doing 11s any time soon. The hypereutectics in there now lasted 160,00 mostly trouble free miles and I've known several people to run up to 25+psi on hypereutectic and cast pistons. Would they be ok on a relatively mild truck?
Click to expand...


Someone needs to check their math. A piston with a 10.5 cc dish a 60.5 cc head chamber will be more like 9.9:1. A 64cc chamber would put it at 9.55:1.

You will be getting fairly high on the CR if you are wanting to run pump gas while passing that car on the interstate.

John
 
s10blaza

s10blaza

BOOSTED
Re: Help with piston selection *kinda long*

I don't know how I missed this before, I checked CL a few days ago and didn't see this. an 05 motor off an Astro

http://elpaso.en.craigslist.org/pts/1615591571.html

I'm going to try and get ahold of the guy tomorrow and maybe look at it if he still has it. The Astro shares the same oil pan as a 4x4 s10. I am actually considering going this route.

This brings another set of questions. The stock specs on the Astro motor list the compression ratio at 9.2:1, so short of knocking down the boost to about 10psi, what can I do get the most out of it? Reliability and performance wise?
 
The Devils Own Chariot

The Devils Own Chariot

Active member
Re: Help with piston selection *kinda long*

A cheap alternative could be getting all your good engine parts cryo treated. Thats the only way i see it getting done with in the budget.
 
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