timing without a light
- Thread starter #2875
- Start date
bezerk
New member
well, these things are verry sensetive to timing..
i think the best way is, to get a indicator as soon as possible, other option is to take the cap off and let the rotor point to cil #1 (when you stand in the front of the car, at the right side, the first cilinder).
can't be that much of, but again if you are going to drive it hard, get it set with a timing light!
i think the best way is, to get a indicator as soon as possible, other option is to take the cap off and let the rotor point to cil #1 (when you stand in the front of the car, at the right side, the first cilinder).
can't be that much of, but again if you are going to drive it hard, get it set with a timing light!
ghettosled
SYTY SUPERSTORE
yeh you pretty much need a light to verify 0 deg with the tan wire disconnected. Gauges and turbolink wont help much.
In order to get the motor started, do what bezerk said. Set motor to TDC, then drop in distributor with rotor facing about 5 O clock when looking towards fire wall. That will be your #1 plug wire. Clockwise is retarded and vise versa. SBC front covers will work, just make sure the dampers are the same size if you want to use the stock pointer. Or just grind it down and buy a new pointer like a B&B, Pioneer, Jeg's etc.
In order to get the motor started, do what bezerk said. Set motor to TDC, then drop in distributor with rotor facing about 5 O clock when looking towards fire wall. That will be your #1 plug wire. Clockwise is retarded and vise versa. SBC front covers will work, just make sure the dampers are the same size if you want to use the stock pointer. Or just grind it down and buy a new pointer like a B&B, Pioneer, Jeg's etc.
#2875
built, not bought
bezerk, i have 4 indicators. as i said before i have turbolink which shows me how much kr i am getting as well as giving audible alarms. i have an led indicator that came with my ultimate chip, i have about 6 spark plugs i can read and i have my ears (whish only work if you unplug the knock sensor or have a chip that doesn't retard). btw, how do you know you are on 0 deg? your pointer is spot welded on your tc cover so it's +- .020 at best. your stock balancer mark is probably off so unless you use a piston stop (correctly) and make a new mark how do you know?
i know i am at a disadvantage without a pointer so please don't rub it in. if you have any positive words i am all ears. "get an indicator asap" doesn't really help me out any. i already knew that.
anyway, i am pretty close now. i have a friend that owns a local speed shop with an awd dyno. i can adjust the timing on the dyno till i get the most tq.
i know i am at a disadvantage without a pointer so please don't rub it in. if you have any positive words i am all ears. "get an indicator asap" doesn't really help me out any. i already knew that.
anyway, i am pretty close now. i have a friend that owns a local speed shop with an awd dyno. i can adjust the timing on the dyno till i get the most tq.
turbodog
Donating Member
What I see here are some pretty experienced folks trying to warn you not to go forward without being able to set your baseline timing correctly. Or, to take it really easy until you can do so. Instead, you seem to be planning full-power, WOT runs. Seems like you have already decided your course, in spite of what is said here. Good luck, let us know how it goes. Maybe you will be teaching us old dogs a new trick.
Ian Turgeon
Cascading Inspiration
sorry for not adding anything usefull..
but how about just blinking your eyes really fast
but how about just blinking your eyes really fast
#2875
built, not bought
turbo, a wise man once told me that the difference between a good mechanic and an average one is knowing what you can get away with. i have been very cautious in what i have been doing thus far. when trying to correct a stumble i replaced everything in the ignition from distributor to spark plug 3 times because the "old dogs" insisted stumble = ignition, ignition, ignition. cleaned and flow tested my injectors and the stumble is gone.
by the way i have a known good gm distributor and mad sets of wires and plugs if anyone is interested. since i'm on the topic i also have 3/8" phenaulic throttle body spacers and 1/2" upper to lower intake spacers since i had to buy 24" X 24" sheets. i also have a couple (early attempts) of alum oil catch cans (between tbody and rear pcv) that don't look great but function 100%.
anyway, any stealership mech will tell you that getting on TDC and pointing the rotor to #1 plug will get you close enough to tune. "our trucks" as the "old dogs" like to say aren't as picky as you ladies make them out to be. i just got on the board too soon instead of listining to my instincts telling me there was something up with fuel flow (check out my old posts, they're pretty funny). my truck runs and pulls great right now; the question i should have asked is does anyone dial in timing based on knock retard levels. my initial question was interpreted as "how do you set base timing" and it went downhill from there. this was my fault... and i do appreciate the responses. i will make my next post in the tuning section and carefully word the intro based on what i have learned today. sorry and good day.
by the way i have a known good gm distributor and mad sets of wires and plugs if anyone is interested. since i'm on the topic i also have 3/8" phenaulic throttle body spacers and 1/2" upper to lower intake spacers since i had to buy 24" X 24" sheets. i also have a couple (early attempts) of alum oil catch cans (between tbody and rear pcv) that don't look great but function 100%.
anyway, any stealership mech will tell you that getting on TDC and pointing the rotor to #1 plug will get you close enough to tune. "our trucks" as the "old dogs" like to say aren't as picky as you ladies make them out to be. i just got on the board too soon instead of listining to my instincts telling me there was something up with fuel flow (check out my old posts, they're pretty funny). my truck runs and pulls great right now; the question i should have asked is does anyone dial in timing based on knock retard levels. my initial question was interpreted as "how do you set base timing" and it went downhill from there. this was my fault... and i do appreciate the responses. i will make my next post in the tuning section and carefully word the intro based on what i have learned today. sorry and good day.
bezerk
New member
i told you that you can adjust timing to get rid of KR, but KR doesn't always have to do annything with your timing..
90% of the stumble is caused by ignition problems,
if you know a good dist. and great wires, just tell us about it, the forum is to share information, the only thing you do is ask a question, somebody answers it, and you tell us that our answer is not based on the truth, .. annyway like turbo dog told you, you already chosed your pad.
if you want to share information, like the rest of us, make a topic about the dist. tell how it works.
Go Dyno that car, adjust timing with your ear, yank out the sparkplugs after a 20sec WOT run. do it!
the way you are talking, you know everything already!
maybe it can be done, but i wouldn't risk the engine if i were in your shoes..
Good luck, and have a fine Dyno day..
90% of the stumble is caused by ignition problems,
if you know a good dist. and great wires, just tell us about it, the forum is to share information, the only thing you do is ask a question, somebody answers it, and you tell us that our answer is not based on the truth, .. annyway like turbo dog told you, you already chosed your pad.
if you want to share information, like the rest of us, make a topic about the dist. tell how it works.
Go Dyno that car, adjust timing with your ear, yank out the sparkplugs after a 20sec WOT run. do it!
the way you are talking, you know everything already!
maybe it can be done, but i wouldn't risk the engine if i were in your shoes..
Good luck, and have a fine Dyno day..
ghettosled
SYTY SUPERSTORE
Work smarter not harder.
Check timing (how hard is it to hook up a timing light?), and hope its around 0. From there you can retard it if it knocks, or advance it if there is no knock. Chances are you wont be able to advance it much over 0 with the poor gas these days. With 118 octane you will be able to get away with alot more. Although you can tune a truck without a scan tool, or timing light it just takes more time and with such useful tools readily available it would make sense to use them.
Check timing (how hard is it to hook up a timing light?), and hope its around 0. From there you can retard it if it knocks, or advance it if there is no knock. Chances are you wont be able to advance it much over 0 with the poor gas these days. With 118 octane you will be able to get away with alot more. Although you can tune a truck without a scan tool, or timing light it just takes more time and with such useful tools readily available it would make sense to use them.
#2875
built, not bought
mike, i can't hook up my light because i don't have a pointer on the tc cover... yet.
my truck is fine, if the timing was too advanced it would knock under boost going up a hill. if is was way retarded it wouldn't run like a scalded dog (new dog) with no mods. besides, timing with a timing light is not as accurate as you ladies make it out to be. did you check your pointers to see if they are precisely in the right place? there is play in the tc cover before the bolts are tightened so that should be checked also. my point is timing with a light isn't 100% accurate either. the best way is on the dyno because you can set the timing to where you make the most hp. advance 1/4 degree: lose power, retard 1/4 degree: lose power. how simple is that? by the way i never claimed to know it all. i'm here asking for other opinions remember?
the eye blinking joke was funny.
my truck is fine, if the timing was too advanced it would knock under boost going up a hill. if is was way retarded it wouldn't run like a scalded dog (new dog) with no mods. besides, timing with a timing light is not as accurate as you ladies make it out to be. did you check your pointers to see if they are precisely in the right place? there is play in the tc cover before the bolts are tightened so that should be checked also. my point is timing with a light isn't 100% accurate either. the best way is on the dyno because you can set the timing to where you make the most hp. advance 1/4 degree: lose power, retard 1/4 degree: lose power. how simple is that? by the way i never claimed to know it all. i'm here asking for other opinions remember?
the eye blinking joke was funny.
#2875
built, not bought
you would put the mark on the flexplate; it isn't there already. you do it just like you set the mark on the balancer with a piston stop.
yes, you would have to get under the truck. yes, you might have to lengthen your battery wires.
yes, it would take 2 people. timing is a task i find faster with 2 people rather than by yourself anyway. plus there are always people hanging around.
yes, you would have to get under the truck. yes, you might have to lengthen your battery wires.
yes, it would take 2 people. timing is a task i find faster with 2 people rather than by yourself anyway. plus there are always people hanging around.
'JustDreamin'
Dream: 6LV8 Turbo Bravada
Hey Boss....
I don't have any input on how to set the timing (base or otherwise).
However, setting the timing based on the flexplate seems overly difficult. The factory tc covers usually have a tab on it, but as we all know, production tolerances and the flexibility of that sheetmetal make that less than reliable. How about one of the ones from Summit Racing? Such as SUM-163800 (adjustable, fits most 8" dampers, obviously use the appropriate sized one for your balancer, cost: about $25)? Wouldn't that be easier than using the flexplate? Laying on the ground to set the timing doesn't sound like fun (personally)
Since that pointer is adjustable, you'd have to set it up. You'd need a degree wheel and a piston stop to find TDC, and then you could set your timing mark "dead on". From then on you'd have a firm reference to use to set your timing (regardless of what method you use to establish what is a "good" timing setting).
Don't get me wrong, I'm not advocating Summit (there are other suppliers). I also don't know if that timing tab will fit in this application. Just wanted to mention that there are TRICK looking aftermarket parts available for just such a situation.
And I think everybody else misread what you said about having a distributor and wires. Sounds like you've got some parts that you'll be wanting to list in the "for sale area"
Good luck. And have fun on "Dyno Day". Please post and let us know how you made out (Hp / Tq / BSFC / whatever seems relavent or worth bragging about).
'Dreamin'
I don't have any input on how to set the timing (base or otherwise).
However, setting the timing based on the flexplate seems overly difficult. The factory tc covers usually have a tab on it, but as we all know, production tolerances and the flexibility of that sheetmetal make that less than reliable. How about one of the ones from Summit Racing? Such as SUM-163800 (adjustable, fits most 8" dampers, obviously use the appropriate sized one for your balancer, cost: about $25)? Wouldn't that be easier than using the flexplate? Laying on the ground to set the timing doesn't sound like fun (personally)
Since that pointer is adjustable, you'd have to set it up. You'd need a degree wheel and a piston stop to find TDC, and then you could set your timing mark "dead on". From then on you'd have a firm reference to use to set your timing (regardless of what method you use to establish what is a "good" timing setting).
Don't get me wrong, I'm not advocating Summit (there are other suppliers). I also don't know if that timing tab will fit in this application. Just wanted to mention that there are TRICK looking aftermarket parts available for just such a situation.
And I think everybody else misread what you said about having a distributor and wires. Sounds like you've got some parts that you'll be wanting to list in the "for sale area"
Good luck. And have fun on "Dyno Day". Please post and let us know how you made out (Hp / Tq / BSFC / whatever seems relavent or worth bragging about).
'Dreamin'
#2875
built, not bought
dreamin, dude... you need to read my last couple of posts. i MADE a pointer and SAVED my money. the timing on the flexplate thing was just an IDEA. i got it from watching airplane mechanics; this is how some airplane engines are timed. except now i want to try it because it seems to be a controversial issue.
oh yea, in my opinion, trick means custom. who are you going to impress with some overpriced chrome plated piece of shit from jegs?
oh yea, in my opinion, trick means custom. who are you going to impress with some overpriced chrome plated piece of shit from jegs?