E85 Experiment

BMFB

BMFB

Not to scale
Tonight I am converting my Typhoon over to E85. List of mods that I have specifically bought to accomplish this:

siemens 80lb injectors

Thats it. Other mods to the truck that will assist with this is my tuning setup which is an ostrichII and yada yada.

I will be removing my Alky Control setup and probably selling it, although it has served me well for a couple years now and having a neat box to play with in the cab always was fun.

I am drawing attention to this as a public view able experiment. I am going to do this, and document it to show what will actually happen, positive or negative. The tank is original to the truck, as are the fuel lines, rubber hoses, and regulator. The fuel filter was swapped out a few years ago and I am fully expecting to have to replace it soon.

Truck I am ruining:

 
0966Sy

0966Sy

Code what?
E85 Experiment

I think with periodic checks on the fuel system you should be just fine. I thought about doing the same thing, just recently I decided to pull the trigger on the alky control kit. I did not want to be dependent on the e85 as they don't have it at the track or close by the track.

Where did you have your alky tank mounted?

Looking forward to your progress and results, hope your still enjoying that road racing.
 
canadian

canadian

sy in progress
Re: E85 Experiment

This looks interesting. E85 is still pretty rare in my area, although I did find one station that sells it about 20 miles from home and on my way to work. I might need to check this out.
 
syclone3

syclone3

Member
Re: E85 Experiment

Been using and tuning with e85 for 8 years now. Wanted to use it in my beater Syclone with a decent set of injectors. Not sure how long the stock rubber fuel hoses will last being as old as they are. Got the tank out now cleaning and replacing the 255. And was pulling the plenum to gasket match and clean it out. Replace stock injectors with a fresh set. Still tempted to get a set of 50-60lbs and try E on 15 psi.
 
J

Jkanser

New member
Re: E85 Experiment

I would recommend a Bosch 040 fuel pump to ensure you have enough fuel. The Walbro 255 pumps aren't the best and I would be worried about maintaining adequate pressure/fuel load with 80lb injectors. Looking forward to seeing how this works out as we are flush with E85 stations here.
 
The Devils Own Chariot

The Devils Own Chariot

Active member
Re: E85 Experiment

The walbro 255 will be plenty for a stock setup as long as it has proper voltage. On stock top end and turbo, the 80lb injectors will not even break a sweat. The 255 pump pushes many applications into the 600hp range. E85 just needs 30% more to make the same BTUs as gas. The stock turbo is going to stop you from making power past 450 Im guessing.
One word of caution I would stay away from any paper based fuel filters using E85. I recommend using a stainless steel fuel filter element. Also , something to think about. If the rubber in the old fuel lines breaks down that could pass clogging to the injectors. Its a good experiment but I would hate to see you have problems.
If I could go back I think I would do the same thing. I would keep the truck stock and run E85. I think it would surpass what most people strive for with modified trucks. With not running alky and using E85 I would think you could add TQ right away off the line on the tune instead of waiting for the alky to start to add more timing.
I’m eager to see your results. This is a subject with not much info on it for our trucks.
 
ajt86

ajt86

Member
Re: E85 Experiment

id love to go e85 but the closest station is 20 miles away. it sucks having to plan your trip to make sure you can get fuel when you want to pleasure cruise.

id definatly replace the rubber fuel hoses its not worth the hassle if theres an issue
 
BMFB

BMFB

Not to scale
Re: E85 Experiment

Turbo sucks, its a 20G with the 'big' exhaust housing, although I cant remember the details on it.

Motor should be good, although I've had trouble in the past with torque converters and bending a crank. Probe pistons, scat crank, eagle H-beams, L35 heads, some cam...Its a pretty slow truck though, usually ends up mid 12's at 110.

Full coverage of the trucks mods are listed in this thread
http://www.syty.net/forums/showthread.php?t=80551

The other truck that I have built and have been tuning on E85 for the last couple years is in this thread:
http://www.syty.net/forums/showthread.php?t=86353
its a tad quicker

As far as the paper filter goes your not wrong. I am planning on switching over to the same filter I cam running on my blazer, which is the flexfuel filter for the GM trucks. They are cheap and can handle it while still being a huge filter with alot of surface area so they last a while.

So, I've tuned my E85 truck for a couple years. I have never tested the fuel going into it, and I have never had an issue with the tune. I beat the piss out of that truck. I run it hard in the summer every weekend, and in the winter. I did not have any issues with a summer blend or winter blend, I did nothing to compensate for the changes. I didn't notice anything huge change in my afr's and I never recorded any knock. I am going to watch this truck more closely than I do the other, because the motor in it is worth 10 times as much to me. I mean that btw, I would rather buy 10 of those stupid motors over this thing.

So progress: I managed to get it running last night with gasoline on the 80's. I ran the truck low on gas and drained as much out of the tank as I could. I went to mijers and bought 16 gallons of E85 and put it in the tank while it was running (always wanted to see what it would do). It took about 5 gallons before it leaned out and died. I adjusted my fuel injector constant 25% positive and it ran pretty rich.

I decided I wanted to re-scale the entire fuel table to compensate for the lost meth, I need to have more resolution at the higher end than I do now, and I don't want to have to do it entirely with a huge boost multiplier. That took about 10 minutes and i think i have a tune that will work to get it to move under its own power. Unfortunelty Michigan's weather is screwing with us and it dumped about 2 inches of snow so that will have to hold off.

Fun note, it seems to take more fuel to get it to start happy. I upped it about 10% on the general fueling map table (400 rpm-0map value) and it starts great. I have it idling at 18:1 at 40* timing advance right now and it likes it, holds solid. I can't wait to get it on the road.
 
BMFB

BMFB

Not to scale
Re: E85 Experiment

had to lean out starting fuel a tad, hated it. It loves timing LOVES TIMING.

I have cruise set to run about 49* advance at about 17:1 afr. It seems good so far. I re-scaled my table to hard and am now having to back off my boost multiplier table.

Going on my first long trip tomorrow. After I return I will be replacing my fuel filter just cause I think I should.
 
Syclone #1188

Syclone #1188

New member
Re: E85 Experiment

Keep us updated. I have been thinking going this route with my sy.. E85 is popular in my area. My brother recently tuned a atv too run on this. It loves timing. I would get rid of the paper fuel filter soon as possible!!
 
BMFB

BMFB

Not to scale
Re: E85 Experiment

Not yet, I haven't gotten into wot stuff and had it work yet.

Went through first tank of gas. Averaged 14mpg, which seems like close to what it got on regular gasoline. Not sure what these trucks normally get. There is some tuning j can do to improve that a bit but honestly 15-16 might be tops.
 
The Devils Own Chariot

The Devils Own Chariot

Active member
Re: E85 Experiment

Here is some data for everyone. I just started my truck last night with a year old tank of E85. It idled real nice. I do have alcohol rated brailed steel fuel lines, stainless steel fuel filter element, and dual walbros with true alcohol subversive hose connecting them. I have taken the precautions with my equipment but outside of that the fuel was stable enough after a year of sitting to start a freshly rebuilt engine.
 
Richie Rich

Richie Rich

New member
Re: E85 Experiment

So no alky needed if running E85? I have an Alky but not installed yet. I was planning to install once base tune is complete. Do you think E85 would be an option for me with 75lb injectors? With 255 pump but stock lines. I was going to get gas for it today. Think I should pick up E85?

Thanks,
Richard
 
The Devils Own Chariot

The Devils Own Chariot

Active member
Re: E85 Experiment

Richie Rich said:
So no alky needed if running E85? I have an Alky but not installed yet. I was planning to install once base tune is complete. Do you think E85 would be an option for me with 75lb injectors? With 255 pump but stock lines. I was going to get gas for it today. Think I should pick up E85?

Thanks,
Richard
Click to expand...

If E85 is available in your area and you can tune for E85..... Its a no brainer. People need to think of it as race gas @ pump prices. Why introduce an alky system that could fail when you can just fill up at the pump with E85? 75lb injectors will definetly work. I have 80s.The stock lines are risky IMO. With one walbro and small stock lines you might run out of enough fuel flow at high boost.

Here is my experince with my Alkycontrol setup.
I had a check vavle on the alky pump fail and caused the injection line to drain back into the holding tank. Causing a delay in alky delivery
I had the alky resivor start boiling from under hood temps. I guess the boiling point for alky is really low. I saw that and I was instantly turned off.
You cant run alky right away on the line unless you has some special system. The kits I have ran off boost pressure or MAP signal.
Why worry about filling up a reservor all the time? Oh and not to mention the invisible fires that can happen.
Lastly..... Alky is not street legal in most states.
My point is made.
 
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