Engine Oiling Improvements

[Don W.]

Re: Engine Oiling Improvements

Well until I find a bypass system could I use 0-30w oil? I have seen oil bypass systems in hydraulic application with my concrete pumps but the fittings are pretty big and pressure is measured in hundreds of bars.

Well my :2cents: would be no. Primarily because I'm old school and I've yet to seen any damage caused by "bypassed" oil. But on the other hand I haven't even decided what to put in my build once it goes together, so pay me the :2cents: and I'll give you some change. :rotf:

 

[4C FED]

Re: Engine Oiling Improvements

Well my :2cents: would be no. Primarily because I'm old school and I've yet to seen any damage caused by "bypassed" oil. But on the other hand I haven't even decided what to put in my build once it goes together, so pay me the :2cents: and I'll give you some change. :rotf:

In a normal operating motor that would be true. But when a bearing goes bad & you bypass dirty oil to your expensive turbo, clog the engine oil cooler & pump metal particles throughout the engine, what good did the bypass do?

 

[Don W.]

Re: Engine Oiling Improvements

Oh believe me I know. My motor spun the 2 center mains. There was chunks of bearing on the oil pickup screen but the other bearings, that is the ones that didn't outright fail, obviously were in distress. As you suggest my main concern was the turbo which seems fine. I'm seriously considering a turbo oil filter for just such a contingency.

Question: Our remote oil filter has 2 bypass valves one for the cooler and one for the filter. On one (I forget which) you're looking at the back, spring portion, of the valve which seems to me would make it difficult to plug. Do you know which one I mean and have you plugged it?

 

[turbodig]

Re: Engine Oiling Improvements

Oh believe me I know. My motor spun the 2 center mains. There was chunks of bearing on the oil pickup screen but the other bearings, that is the ones that didn't outright fail, obviously were in distress.?

Not because of any problem in the oiling system, I'd bet.

Deto pushed the crank into the center mains, they grabbed, and spun.
It's almost *always* the center 2.

If there were really oiling issues, the front would go first.

Basic pumps are fine for most motors, unless you're building that 8k RPM+ monster.

Leave the oil holes alone. Work on getting your bearing clearances to be good, and smooth the passages from the pump to the rear main cap.

Most guys don't realize that you can put the big $ into oiling, cranks, and rods, and still blow the bottom of the block off with detonation. Nothing lives through pinging.

The v6 oiling system kinda sucks for big revs, by design, but we're not running the big revs. The guys that are get the bowtie blocks set up to force more oil to the mains, sacrificing oil to the lifter galleys.

 

[Don W.]

Re: Engine Oiling Improvements

It's almost *always* the center 2.

Which gets to one of my other theory's. :roll: The center mains have rods on both sides of them. The front and rear have rods on only one side. The centers see twice as much load, yet the centers are not any bigger (wider). I don't have my block to look at but you will see the rear as a wider bearing but I always thought that was because of the weight of the flywheel and clutch. But that's just my guess. Oh well... Makes me wish I had taken mechanical engineering. When I used to doodle I would draw cross sections of engines. Usually the Offenhauser.

 

[blk00z28]

Re: Engine Oiling Improvements

http://www.stockcarracing.com/techarticles/134_0309_oil_pumps_street_stock/index.html

Found this today searching for ported oil pump pictures. Thought it had some good info in it.

 

[turbodig]

Re: Engine Oiling Improvements

Which gets to one of my other theory's. :roll: The center mains have rods on both sides of them. The front and rear have rods on only one side. The centers see twice as much load, yet the centers are not any bigger (wider). I don't have my block to look at but you will see the rear as a wider bearing but I always thought that was because of the weight of the flywheel and clutch. But that's just my guess. Oh well... Makes me wish I had taken mechanical engineering. When I used to doodle I would draw cross sections of engines. Usually the Offenhauser.

The rear is wider primarily because of the need to attach an oil pump to it. It also needs a bit extra meat since it's controlling the thrust forces.

The middle caps see the majority of the engine load... effectively, the sum of the rod loads.The SBC has an advantage in this regard, since there's an extra main with only 2 extra rods to drive load into it.

The solution is not in the oiling, but in not letting it ping. You can 4-bolt the mains with steel caps, and the crank will still get pushed into the center bearings. And then they spin.

It is *possible* that a stronger crank would deflect less, which would help the tendency to bend in the middle. I would think it would only be a slight help, though.

 

[Don W.]

Re: Engine Oiling Improvements

This makes me wish we all lived in the same town so we could have these discussions over lunch. :tup:

 

[UR50SLO]

Re: Engine Oiling Improvements

I ended up going back to a non HV pump this time. I got it from the local shop I have do my machine work.
I got worried about the HV pump sucking my pan dry on a full pass. Not returning fast enough.
Some have good luck with the HV but I'm not taking a chance.

I also purchased a set of Calico Coated bearings. I'm running them in the Camaro and really like they way they worked this year.

I ended up with another stock crank (grumble) since the billet one's are way outa my price range and if I were going to buy that good of a crank it would not be going into a Bowtie block... and then the end of my duribility problems.... and or bank account.
~Scott